1976 Chevy Death Wobble

From past conversations I know there are a few redneck, die hard, lifted pick-up truck types who are members. I am wondering about Death Wobble.

To anyone who has never experienced this, it almost cannot be explained. I experienced it for the first time last week as Horsey Teen twisted my arm and dared me to drive her stupid, big truck. At a certain RPM in a certain gear, there is a Death Wobble. It is like being in your very own, personal, off the scale earhtquake. Everything flies off the dash, stuff on the floor slams into everything else. If you were not belted in you would also be slammed to the floor and it is a battle to hang onto that steering wheel.

No, it is NOT the tires. Even Hubby, when he experienced the Death Wobble said, there is something seriously wrong with that truck! However, an internet search shows that Death Wobble is a known problem, although the jury is out on the cause and cure. As I was freaking out thinking this was it, this was the end and daughter, gripping the dash with both hands to remain in her seat yelled, BOOT IT!...and you drive out of the Death Wobble and go merrily on as if nothing happened.

So..collective wisdom of once young and foolish country boy(and girl) types. What causes this and how does one fix it?

In my 4x4ing days I gave my poor truck the dreaded death wobble. In fact, if the pavement wasn't wet from rain I also had "driving straight tire squeech". I had to have the ball joints in the front end replaced. It was all brought about by some tough 4x4 trails in which there was a section of river bed driving (dry river bed) and perhaps the tire met the side of the riverbed once or twice, thereby disrupting and ruining the ball joints. Nothing about 2grand didn't cover in my case.

One of my first vehicles was an old (year forgotten) Datsun pickup. It was literally held together with duct tape and high tensile fence wire. It had that "death wobble" and I was told at the time that it had something to do with my "king pin". I had and have no idea if there's an actual piece on a vehicle called a king pin, but I never did get it fixed, I just booted it past that 80-something kph speed that brought it on. I agree - it was VERY dangerous.

Good luck Uno.

I've had 4 by 4s for most of the last 40 years and have yet to experience this problem. Most of my 4wd trucks have been Dodges although there was one 73 Blazer. Apparently it is a problem with some of the current generation of larger Dodge trucks and almost impossible to fix in vehicles where this occurs. Most times the problem seems to involve the ball joints (king pins perform the same function) or the structure supporting the ball joints. Some of the 70s Chev 4wd drives had trouble with the frame cracking where the Saginaw steering box attached to the frame. This was not a problem with the Dodges at the time which used the same steering because the box was attached differently. One of the things you should check is the steering box mount.

Once you lift a truck up and put on oversized tires YOU NEED TO WORK UP THE FRONT END AS WELL ( you might also want to check the drive shaft and the U-joint's )!Most kids think that air shocks or over ride shocks will do it , but the way that the front should work has been changed and it will cause a serious accident if not done ASAP ! Lets face it if our cars would do that we would have it in the garage real quickly , so please have the front end checked ! something is wearing out or has been pushed to it's limit's !

It would be fair to say the entire truck has been pushed to its limit! Hubby has already groaned and shook his head over some of the stupid things he's found (and fixed). I see this truck not being too bad on gas, since it will spend most of its time on the ramp.

Rosewood, read Hubby your post and he said hmmm.... that is never a good sound. All other suggested parts/problems have been investigated. Thanks all.

Our Jeep Cherokee sometimes gets that wobble. It has a lift kit in it, too. I hear what you mean about having to get up past a certain speed to get your self out of the wobble. The worst is when you get behind a slow person or people, and have to try and maintain death wobble speed. Makes for a scary ride home. In our case, I think it may have been the tires, though. I haven't noticed it since the winter tires went on.

Our Ford Contour would get that aweful wobble. When we last had it to be worked on, a guy who works with my Brother In Law asked if it had ever been jumped. Nooooo, but my husband used to take it grouse hunting on some pretty wild roads. The Car is now retired. Poor thing.

After posting here last night I did some goggling and was surprised that this is a problem with many different brands of vehicles. I've been lurking around some truck forums when I get bored with the farm forums. Big tires and lifts are often associated with DW as are worn suspension parts. With suspensions DW can occur when many of the parts have a tiny amount of wear, but added together makes for quite a bit of play. Some Fords and perhaps Dodges have some vibration in the actual frame which they have attempted to correct with spray in foam. Stock parts may be too weak to handle heavy use like grouse hunting. There are companies that make heavy duty after market parts for these vehicles.

I've been checking out truck sites too, ROsewood and was shocked by the number of NEW vehicles that suffer from this! I had assumed this would only ever be a problem with old, modified trucks. It's one thing to expect it in an old truck you've monkeyed around with. BUt boy, would I be mad if I have a newer vehicle and had a Death WObble! IT must be very frustrating for those owners who have stock rides and this problem anyway.

PS What do you mean "when you get bored with farm forums"? I think your membership will have to be reviewed and debated after that remark. Treason!

Just to add to this, my Datsun truck was a 2wd, not lifted or otherwise modified (except with duct tape as mentioned) but I can't be certain it didn't do it's share of off-roading prior to me buying it.

The problem of DW is not just one for 4wd. In the pursuit of making 4wds with a sofa ride the suspensions have become much more complex. Using coil springs on a single axle front axles -bigger Fords and Dodges- means adding control arms to keep everything in place. The old teeth jarring trucks had heavy axles on leaf springs that rarely moved even grouse hunting.

The Death Wobble is hard to pinpoint, due to the number of modifiers involved.

There are too many parts in the front end of vehicles that will produce this sort of thing (especially 4X4's) ball joints being one of them. Inadequate steering stabilizers on larger, lifted vehicles being another. The list goes on... The only surefire solution on the old chevys, would be be a complete front end overhaul, which is a ridiculous idea.

Owning a 77 Chev, with all the same parts as is in your daughters' truck, I am familiar with this. It has also happened in our 95 1 ton Chev Dually. This DW is not prejudiced against anything it seems.

On a side note, I mentioned once that the frame needed to be reinforced around the steering box, as the 70's chevys had "spaghetti frame". The lower bolt on the box was mounted so low, that eventually, on most well used, and modified chevs, the frames cracked right underneath it due to torque, and stress, and would eventually tear the box right off.

This could also, as mentioned above, be a factor.

Without actually seeing how that truck is put together, its hard to decide where to start hunting for the dreaded DW.
As long as you know its in the front end, at least there's standard places to look. J would know I'm sure but I will tell you how I would attack the problem in order.

J has probably checked most of this...

Easy visual stuff first.

Tie rod ends and drag link. No play
Pittman arm to steering box. With that much lift, this would have been changed to an aftermarket one. No play.
Steering box tightness in output shaft and tightness to the frame itself.
Steering stabilizer. Not generally important, but if it (or THEY I'm thinking) are dead, it would help with the problem for a bit.

Next would be the ball joints .
Then bearings and spindles. Playing in mud, I'm betting the bearings are due for repacking anyway.
Mud wrecks shit. Plain and simple. Its fun to play in, but you spend more time under your vehicle than running thru ruts.

Also, on top of the right side steering knuckle, is a small piece of metal where there tie rod end mounts (god knows I can't think of the name) sometimes the bolt hole gets worn oblong and creates play in the steering. Its a part any machine shop can make for a few $.

Hillbilly has a good list above. From what I've been reading tires may be a problem even if they look good as in some cases the DW goes away just switching tires. Warped brake (this is the correct spelling as I've seen this spelled wrong nuimerous times lately) rotors are the source of DW with some vehicles.

Hubby's advise
Check steering components ie; balljoints, tierod ends
wheel bearings, steering stabalizer.

Hubby had same exp. cause was worn balljoint.
Wheel bearings can also cause this at certain
highway speeds.

Also mud or snow and ice build up behind rims
can put tire balance out.

Are the tires bias or radial?
Bias ply are more common to this problem.
And shackle lifts on leaf spring front ends
also contrubute to this.

Thanks all for your wisdom, I knew it was out there! Hubby will wait for the coldest, most miserabe day then be laying out on the ice, poking around looking for worn parts. The man really does need a shop.

Karona, to be honest I don't know if the tires are radial or bias ply. THey are 38 inch super swampers and stupidly large, that's all I know.

MErcifully, the beast is parked for the winter since those tires are NOT snow tires! Maybe Hubby can leave the Sherlock Holmes detective work until spring. Then he can lay in mud instead of snow. Yipee!

There is a definite shortage of good shops. I'm waiting for a rainy day to replace motor mounts, ball joints and tie rod ends. The 1st generation Dodges and the 70's Chevy's had almost identical front ends except gear ratios. On the Dodges the steering shaft between the steering column and the steering box is poor design with an after market upgrade part.

uno wrote:Thanks all for your wisdom, I knew it was out there! Hubby will wait for the coldest, most miserabe day then be laying out on the ice, poking around looking for worn parts. The man really does need a shop.

Karona, to be honest I don't know if the tires are radial or bias ply. THey are 38 inch super swampers and stupidly large, that's all I know.

MErcifully, the beast is parked for the winter since those tires are NOT snow tires! Maybe Hubby can leave the Sherlock Holmes detective work until spring. Then he can lay in mud instead of snow. Yipee!

Your hubby sounds just like mine and my son.
If you wish I could try to remember to ask son when ever he passes through (he lives here) this is right up his alley. Works for Lordco and has built several raised trucks.

This is one of those things like chasing down a vibration in the driveline.
Sometimes you get lucky and find it right away, sometimes you can replace many things before the culprit is found. There is no one thing that always causes this. That's why you haven't found a definitive answer.
There are so many variables involved. I know J will find it, I just hope it's quickly, and easily.

I'm happy to hear it is parked. The forces that are exerted on the front end of a vehicle when it goes through the DW are tremendous, and increase drastically the more lift and bigger tires it has. The chances of doing greater damage are highly probable.

Super Swampers are the name of a tire much the same as Firestone, Goodyear, Michelin, etc. All Super Swampers are radial ply tires as are practically all tires used on cars and trucks today. Bias tires are used for agriculture, heavy vehicles, and atvs today. Up until the 70's radial tires were not commonly used and even as late as 1976 there may have been some "bias" about the use of them on current models. Radials tires have replaced bias tire on all cars and trucks since the 70's, even those on pre-70s cars and trucks.

I have to disagree with you rosewood. For every radial there is a bias ply tire. You have to specific to your tire "guy" if you want either. Its especially true for super swampers. All you have to do is go to a 4x4 tire site and start looking we just finish helping the brother shop for his.
With bias ply tires you can "air" them down to max your traction, ground coverage your footprint. With bias they use nylon ply sidewalls. Which is why you get your DW because after you stop and they cool and "form" to that shape ie. flat spot.
Radials are steel belted sidewalls. Made with spring steel so they retain the shape of the tire better.
However DW usually starts with play in the tie rod, which is supposed to sync the tires together. If there is play there they are moving independantly.A sure indication of tie rod or ball joint problems is excessive wear on inner or outer edges of the tire, or both also known as cupping.
I have experienced the DW its NOT cool.It was because of bias tires.
I have attained this knowledge from 26 yrs of experience with driving & owning heavy duty trucks ie... Peterbilt, Kenworth all the way down to extreme 4x4ing.
Our example would be 6in lift on a chevy 3/4ton 35"tires and 8000lbs warn winch and sank to the bottom of the windshield.....river,ocean,tide flats, snow, ect...
I've also had 44" on a 76 chevy shortbox 3/4ton and sank it in the river till it floated. Lots of experience its our favorite past time.we actually prefer the old straight axle version as opposed to the newer. Its cheaper easier and faster to repair or rebuild.
I would to continue on this thread but lunch is ready. Thanks for reading

As has been pointed out, DW has many and sundry causes. I do not think its the tires, in our case. DW only happens in 3rd gear at around 35mph. THen you hold on for dear life and gas your way out of it and hope the truck is still mostly in one piece. I have to think that whatever this is, is NOT good for a vehicle!

These Super Swampers aren't helping, but at this point I don't think they are the sole cause.

Karona, I sure hope you can get your pics posted as I would love to see what your boy has built. Our daughter doesn't build them, she just buys them and brings them home and bats her eyelashes at Daddy to fix them. ALthough Hubby has tweaked a vehicle or two in his time. That lifted 1980 shortbox with the gleaming paint job is his handiwork. He doesn't drive it. Just sets mouse traps in it. Whatever.

Hubby doesn't cruise WCPS very often but he reads every post in this thread, rubbing his chin thoughtfully as he does. Let's hope all you redneck boys never get together with a case of beer, a pile of parts when one of you says, hey, let's build one of those chainsaws with a V8! Heaven help us!

I got my information from tire web sellers and not 4 x 4 specific sites. I've had 4wd almost continuously since the early 70s, but my use is more with trailer towing, farm work and general highway driving. I haven't been tire shopping lately. I would buy radial tires around 30 inches. My truck has a small lift.