Western Canada Poultry Swap

Forum dedicated to the buying and selling of quality heritage poultry in Western Canada.


You are not connected. Please login or register

Sourcing Stock: Commercial Hatcheries.

View previous topic View next topic Go down  Message [Page 1 of 1]

1 Sourcing Stock: Commercial Hatcheries. on Mon Mar 31, 2014 12:43 pm

toybarons

avatar
Golden Member
Golden Member
"Exhibtion Poultry" is a nice monthly magainze you can download for free. Recently, things have been a bit stupid in my life and so I nearly forgot to download March's issue.

Hatchery Stock vs Breeding Stock is an ongoing topic for discussion. I was surprised to see this very topic being discussed in this magazine. A magazine dedicated to show poultry.

"Sourcing Stock: Commercial Hatcheries" by Brian Reeder. Download and read and discuss.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

2 Re: Sourcing Stock: Commercial Hatcheries. on Mon Mar 31, 2014 5:53 pm

Blue Hill Farm

avatar
Golden Member
Golden Member
Good article. I enjoyed reading it, thank you for posting the link. Epigenetics and the role environment plays on shaping our birds (and us) is fascinating stuff really.

Hmm. I’ve never felt there was anything wrong with starting with hatchery birds if that was the best source of stock available. Not all breeds are easy to get ones hands on…some are next to possible. Besides, I don’t think hatchery birds are bad per say. If anything, they are strong, resourceful chickens bred for production first and foremost. Of course, not all hatcheries are created equal, nor are their birds. (But neither are breeders if we're throwing stones.  tongue) And I would think most hatcheries are run by skilled professionals who know what they are doing or employ those that do. Maintaining huge, diverse gene pools on such a large scale is no small feat imo.

Hatchery stock vs. breeder stock, what's the big deal?  I don\'t get it

3 Re: Sourcing Stock: Commercial Hatcheries. on Mon Mar 31, 2014 6:06 pm

Schipperkesue

avatar
Golden Member
Golden Member
I have not read the article yet...but plan to.

I think the main difference is where do you want to go with your breeding. For some outcomes breeder stock maybe better, for others hatchery stock maybe the way to go.

That said, sometimes the only stock available to you in uncommon breeds may be hatchery stock, leaving you no choice if your heart is set on the breeds you want!

Now, to do a little reading and to see if I need to do a little editing!  Razz 

4 Re: Sourcing Stock: Commercial Hatcheries. on Mon Mar 31, 2014 6:18 pm

ipf


Addicted Member
Addicted Member
I also enjoyed the article, and found it mainly sound, but thought the bit on epigenetics was a bit glib. Epigenetics is the latest "cool" thing in genetics, and although it undoubtedly really is cool, invoking it to explain everything that isn't easily explained by something else is probably. . . well, not right.

5 Re: Sourcing Stock: Commercial Hatcheries. on Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:12 pm

Schipperkesue

avatar
Golden Member
Golden Member
Well, thanks for the whole magazine, TB! I was also enjoying a drool over some of those pictures of show winners. Must say, I am not doing too badly with my silkies by comparison!

As for the article...much food for thought, and having had many varieties of hatchery birds from three different hatcheries I must say that much of the author's observations are spot on. I was particularly interested to see that comments on disease immunity concur with my own experiences.

Please be sure to share part 2!

6 Re: Sourcing Stock: Commercial Hatcheries. on Mon Mar 31, 2014 11:11 pm

toybarons

avatar
Golden Member
Golden Member
I felt the article really reflected my own experiences. I only have a basic high school bio knowledge of genetics. When it gets into the technical specifics, I get lost fast unless you have a nice picture book to walk me through. When I decided to breed LF Mottled Houdans back in 2009, I only had hatchery stock to work with. I experienced pretty much most of what the writer did. Only with Houdans I would say worse. I won't bore you guys but to say there was more than once I wanted to chuck the whole lot and get myself certified as to why I choose Houdans. I cried more times, over failed hatches.
I didn't need to cull hatchery chicks. Hatchery Houdans seems to have their own die-off schedueled of their own. First at 2 weeks, then at 4 weeks and finally at 10-12 weeks. Out of 10 chicks, if less than 5 made it to 12 weeks, I was just happy that something managed to make it, even if it was far from being SOP. Even those known APA breeders of Houdans have danced this waltz because simple put. The stocks are so poor that to get good, healthy gentics to work with when breeding Houdans will drive you bonkers.

I was just happy to read an article from someone who just told me that the way I started wasn't so wrong. Even after all the tears.

7 Re: Sourcing Stock: Commercial Hatcheries. on Tue Apr 01, 2014 8:32 am

Blue Hill Farm

avatar
Golden Member
Golden Member
toybarons wrote: I was just happy to read an article from someone who just told me that the way I started wasn't so wrong. Even after all the tears.

Best piece of advice I ever read about where to start was written by master breeder Ralph H. Sturgeon. Simply put, start where you are with what you have. Then once you know what you've got to work with, you can begin to look for other lines that have traits you want to bring over to yours.

Mr. Sturgeon has passed on, but lucky for us he left behind a little gem of a booklet full of timeless, practical information about the art of breeding. Best $20 I ever spend. I got my reprint from here if anyone is interested....you won't regret it!  Smile 

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

8 Re: Sourcing Stock: Commercial Hatcheries. on Tue Apr 01, 2014 1:46 pm

KathyS

avatar
Golden Member
Golden Member
Blue Hill Farm wrote:
toybarons wrote: I was just happy to read an article from someone who just told me that the way I started wasn't so wrong. Even after all the tears.

Best piece of advice I ever read about where to start was written by master breeder Ralph H. Sturgeon. Simply put, start where you are with what you have. Then once you know what you've got to work with, you can begin to look for other lines that have traits you want to bring over to yours.

Mr. Sturgeon has passed on, but lucky for us he left behind a little gem of a booklet full of timeless, practical information about the art of breeding. Best $20 I ever spend. I got my reprint from here if anyone is interested....you won't regret it!  Smile 

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Like

http://www.hawthornhillpoultry.com

9 Re: Sourcing Stock: Commercial Hatcheries. on Tue Apr 01, 2014 2:32 pm

KathyS

avatar
Golden Member
Golden Member
I've always maintained that hatcheries have their place and they make an important contribution in getting people started in chicken-keeping. But the recurring theme in the article is selection. Yes, purchasing chickens from a good hatchery can give a person a start, but then they need to be prepared to do some serious selection from amongst those birds if they want to make progress towards their goals.

In some cases I think people would be farther ahead ordering chicks directly from a good hatchery rather than buying from someone who is selling the same thing privately. Now, I'm not talking about a well-established breeder who has been working hard and making good progress with their line for 5 or 6 or more years. That's still the best way to get a good start in a breed or variety (my opinion!).

But there are many private sellers who sell chicks and eggs from a trio or small group they have kept back from their own hatchery chicks they bought the previous year. In both of these cases I would need to be prepared to do some heavy culling, but I'd get a wider range of genetic material to play with if my chicks come straight from the hatchery, rather than from a trio that came from the same hatchery.

http://www.hawthornhillpoultry.com

10 Re: Sourcing Stock: Commercial Hatcheries. on Wed Apr 02, 2014 9:50 am

Bob G


Member
Member
Ouch, I am getting old. I bought Ralph Sturgeon s book directly from him, it was 5 bucks . Now to quote an older  Very Happy  mentor Good Birds are were you find them.

11 Re: Sourcing Stock: Commercial Hatcheries. on Fri Apr 04, 2014 8:05 am

Blue Hill Farm

avatar
Golden Member
Golden Member
KathyS wrote:I've always maintained that hatcheries have their place and they make an important contribution in getting people started in chicken-keeping.  But the recurring theme in the article is selection.  Yes, purchasing chickens from a good hatchery can give a person a start, but then they need to be prepared to do some serious selection from amongst those birds if they want to make progress towards their goals.

In some cases I think people would be farther ahead ordering chicks directly from a good hatchery rather than buying from someone who is selling the same thing privately. Now, I'm not talking about a well-established breeder who has been working hard and making good progress with their line for 5 or 6 or more years. That's still the best way to get a good start in a breed or variety (my opinion!).

But there are many private sellers who sell chicks and eggs from a trio or small group they have kept back from their own hatchery chicks they bought the previous year. In both of these cases I would need to be prepared to do some heavy culling, but I'd get a wider range of genetic material to play with if my chicks come straight from the hatchery, rather than from a trio that came from the same hatchery.

Well said Kathy.   

12 Re: Sourcing Stock: Commercial Hatcheries. on Fri Apr 04, 2014 8:07 am

Blue Hill Farm

avatar
Golden Member
Golden Member
Bob G wrote:Ouch, I am getting old. I bought Ralph Sturgeon s  book directly from him, it was 5 bucks . Now to quote an older  Very Happy  mentor  Good Birds are were you find them.

 Like 

 Very Happy

Sponsored content


View previous topic View next topic Back to top  Message [Page 1 of 1]

Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum