Snowden and Education

I've been following this Snowden thing with considerable interest, and today I finally became so annoyed with a statement that has been made so many times on CNN that I felt like venting it, to see if I'm just that far out there.

This morning's CNN Headline for Snowden said "How is a high-school drop out able to evade just about everybody."

The unfortunate stereotype that high school drop outs are stupid is one that drives me incredibly insane.  They love to go on to say he has no college education so how did he get that job!  I think it's a terrible misconception that people who do not complete an education are not smart or capable.  Though not a high school dropout, I am a college dropout as I simply could not learn quick enough the way College/University dictates you must.  The hilarious part?  Though my job pays crap squat in comparison to other parts of the industry, I make more or the same as some of my friends who are paying off educational debt, most of whom aren't even working in their field of choice.

I am not one to gloat, and this isn't an attempt to do so as I don't agree with what people say, but I've often been told I am really smart and intellectual, college education be damned.  Everyone is so amazed that he has dodged the system, yet listening to interviews about Snowden (which CNN cut short and off several times when the interviewee's were pro-Snowden), he walked with his head down, at certain angles, knew where cameras were everywhere he went, used old phones that had the battery removed when not in use and did not have a camera, wore a hood and taped up the camera on his PC's and laptops, as well as removing or damaging microphones.  "It's so amazing we can't find him."  NO IT ISN'T!  He's trained in how this system works, he knows how to avoid it, where it's in effect and what he needs to do to get away.

Regardless of what you think of what Snowden did (or didn't do), I think there is a valid issue here when it comes to defacing people on an education premise.  I suppose it's a campaign of CNN and other forms of croney media to paint him as an insolent spy, an idiot betrayer on the run, however I have seen it in other aspects of life, heard it in conversations (especially amongst the elderly) that those without an education are nothing/will be nothing/can never do anything with their lives and that is simply. not. true.

Education is just another social bias that exists with all the others......

I rather admire the man.  I wonder how history will paint him?

Depends which history book you read.  Published in the US (probably Canada as well), he'll be painted as a defacto spy; In Russia, China, or South American history books will be written differently indeed.

I think he is the opening act to the quick downfall of a corrupt system, that's why I watch with so much interest.  Finally, someone with the testicular fortitude to stand up for what they believe in.  Don't get me wrong, there will likely be a war over this, but no one likes being found out.

Likely with tar...

coopslave wrote:Education is just another social bias that exists with all the others......

Yep.

Not sure that turning to Russia, Cuba and Equador is a sign of valuing freedom of speech or democracy!

heda gobbler wrote:Not sure that turning to Russia, Cuba and Equador is a sign of valuing freedom of speech or democracy!

I don't think turning to those countries has, really, anything to do with their freedom of speech, and the US 'democracy' has become quite a gong show, really.  Going to those countries means not being killed by the government (which he will be if they have the chance); those countries in particular will NOT make him keep his mouth shut about ANYTHING.  It's advantageous to them to have him in their midst and allow him to leak all he wants to leak.

There we will disagree.  Anything he says in those countries will be very carefully controlled.  I wouldn't be surprised if he were prevented from leaving.  He is already a pawn.

It'll be interesting to see how it turns out for sure.

For myself, I'm glad to know what he revealed.

But they're going to make him pay.  In the end, I don't know that he'll find it was worth it.

George Carlin was right.  We have owners and they certainly don't like people who rock the boat.

Fowler wrote:But they're going to make him pay.  In the end, I don't know that he'll find it was worth it.

George Carlin was right.  We have owners and they certainly don't like people who rock the boat.

I love G. Carlin.

They will make him pay indeed.  But then, if he's truly fighting for something be believes in, maybe it will all be worth it.  He's already given up a $200k $140K per year job, no debts, a beautiful girlfriend and house, friends and family.  To pack up and leave all of those things for something you believe in is not something you do because you kind of sort of think the risks are worth it.

He said in his online live feed that if he goes missing or is killed, there is someone to continue to release info.

Another great quote from a George (Orwell):
In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

? I never watch CNN , to much of walking around truths etc to be bothered .Prefer Sun News myself ..........but seldom watch any news ! it's never good news now is it ?

Sweetened, as a homeschooler I was bombarded with everyone's opinion on the massive damage I was doing to my child by denying her the grand and valuable experience of public school.

What utter hog crap.

I also found it grossly rude of people to give me their opinion on what I was doing, as if what I was doing was any of their damn business!  And the worst lectures came from people who had obviously not had an original thought a day in their lives. They are just re-pukers of what The Man has told them. Sorry for those who are about to be offended, but many of us (not all) consider school 12 years of glorified daycare.

Success in school and success in life are not the same thing. Let me say that again for clarity. SCHOOL and LIFE are not the same thing. You can suck at school and be a wild success at life! That anyone would snub you due to a lack of education says more about them than it ever will about you!

I know that employers want to see education on a resume. I think this points to increasingly stupid employers who have abandoned the task of truly evaluating potential employees. THey are lazy, they want it easy, they want to look at your resume and know that you 'have what it takes'. OF course, you can take all the training and courses in the world and still be a flaming idiot without a shred of work ethic. Knowledge is not quality...but we have lost this sight of this truth.

I agree with you Sweetend. There has become an over-emphasis on education. But you have to remember that education is an industry like any other and perpetuating the myth that education makes you better is no different than believing that Crest makes your teeth whiter. It's advertising, which people have come to believe as proven truth. But it ain't so. Always remember, people used to believe with utter certainty that the earth was flat. We've been wrong about things before, we will continue to be wrong about things. The steadfast belief that the only way to a good life is education is one of those beliefs. But as you have seen here, there are the non-believers, who live good lives on their own terms, thank you very much!

Now I'm just imagining a grammar lesson;

That thing is utter hog crap.
Those things are utter hog crap.
That thing was utter hog crap.
Those things were utter hog crap.

Fowler wrote:Now I'm just imagining a grammar lesson;

That thing is utter hog crap.
Those things are utter hog crap.
That thing was utter hog crap.
Those things were utter hog crap.

Correct or incorrect, the message is abundantly clear!

You should graph those sentences.  *Falls over*  I still haven't found another time in my life where I've ever said: "Well thank THE STARS ABOVE that I learned to graph sentences or I would have NEVER been able to program that software or make a left turn in this really small compact car."

Sweetened wrote:This morning's CNN Headline for Snowden said "How is a high-school drop out able to evade just about everybody."

The unfortunate stereotype that high school drop outs are stupid is one that drives me incredibly insane.

I dunno, most of the high school drop outs that I have met are not all that bright.

Of course, neither are a lot of the high school graduates.

Udder hog crap? Utter hog crap? Unutterable hog crap? Did I say something wrong?

Fowler wrote:Now I'm just imagining a grammar lesson;

That thing is utter hog crap.
Those things are utter hog crap.
That thing was utter hog crap.
Those things were utter hog crap.

Oh Fowler, you always make me laugh out loud.  Too funny!

In regards to drop outs ? well my Brother In Laws brother is one of the wealthiest men in Alberta ( not the oil fields ) and he had a grade six education ( came from a low income family of 14 ) ! He never saw much use in a lot of what is being taught in our schools ( I have my doubts as well ) and he went out and actually used his head and built himself a empire .Lear jets , 6000 sq ft cottages with only one bed room , maids and butlers etc so education ? while  it might help some ( diploma's etc) some choose to do it on there own with what has been given to them .........sorry , had to throw in my two cents !....back to the topic

I think that IS the topic!

authentic farm.........I take offense to your statement about drop outs.     There are so many people that never finished high school, that are now extremely wealthy.

These people have a gift, to take the things they excelled in and turn them into huge money making business.   There are an incredible amount of people that get very little out of

school.      There are things I have done for jobs that school never would have helped me with.   I worked for 8 yrs  on Vancouver Island cutting herring strip, to be put in a plastic

holder and used for sports fishing.  You had to be precise, fast and willing to work hard, but we made more money than the girls working in the banks at the time.   

What school is going to train me for that type of work?     Then later in life worked as a dispatcher for taxi's and tow trucks,  after going in the tow truck with my husband I knew the

lingo, knew the drivers and am totally at ease talking on the phone or the radio phones.   Not everyone can get on the phone etc. and talk to just anyone.  I know a lot of people that

will not answer the phone unless they have to.   I was even at ease enough to be an announcer for various horse shows.   Was told I did very well too.  I enjoyed it, because that

and selling things are my forte in life.   I know a lot of people that can't sell their way out of a paper bag.

I am not trying to brag, but I sure don't like it when people hack down people that didn't finish school.  I didn't due to various things beyond my control.   But I don't consider

myself dumb.

A reminder however that most of the very poor and homeless did not finish high school either. So while finishing high school is no guarantee of success dropping out is certainly not a sure path to riches either.

Hmmm...lots to kick around here.

You hear so much about child poverty in Canada. Child poverty? I think that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard.  As if children are stand alone units. They are not. They are parts of families, whole or otherwise. There is FAMILY poverty which leads to children living in disadvantaged situations.

Children who mostly (making sweeping generalizations here) live in poverty to begin with, who are so unsupported that they cannot make it through school, do not live below the poverty level due to lack of education, but due to certain lifestyles repeating themselves. It is not dropping out of school  that puts their future income in jeopardy, but the fact that their whole life was unsupported and maybe never learned there is another way to live.

I think there was a time, in the past, where higher education was equated with greater pay. But I think that is less true now. You do not need to go to school to be an entrepreneur, you need to be a risk taker. No one can teach you that. My dad was functionally illiterate and yet did business internationally. My mom had to look numbers up for him in phonebooks and read the mail to him, but he travelled and did business with people from all over the planet. He used to say how can some secure professor in a guaranteed job with a guaranteed income and guaranteed clients (students) tell you one damn thing about being a businessman when he has never earned a risk dollar in his life! You want to be a businessman, risk everything you own to borrow money to undertake a project. Boom, you're in business, sink or swim!

No, I do not agree with the statistic that higher education = more money. Does a high school education = higher education? Because as Authentic (I think) rightly pointed out, high school turns out just as many failures as successes.

SO it is not schooling alone that determines success. And by the way, who said more money is more success?   We have defined success very narrowly, shame on us all. Can you be poor and successful? Poor and happy? Poor and a good person who contributes to your community anyway? Don't they say it's the poor who give the most? If all you do to count your success in life is view your wallet, then you've spent your life focusing on your ass.

Kids who don't make it through school due to tough family situations have a harder time in life and it's not due to lack of school, but due to the tough family situation, and this is an important distinction. It gives too much credit to school, and too little credit to good homes/parents.