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Who Vaccinate's their flocks?

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1 Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Wed Mar 16, 2011 6:41 pm

Hidden River

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I am wondering how many people in our chicken world vaccinate their birds? What do you vaccinate for?
This year I started doing all my day olds with Marek's vaccine, was scary the first time but got easier as I went on.
I also started doing ILT vaccine, it is pretty simple to do, just the record keeping is hard since you need to booster them after the innitial and with different batches of chicks it could get confusing without the proper records.
I am starting to wing band any of my keepers, and leg band any birds that go into an older batch of chicks that still need a booster so I remember them.
Hey eherd, any record keeping software out there to help simplify this???


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Raising Heritage Chickens, Guinea Fowl, Waterfowl, Katahdin Sheep, Angus and Jersey Cattle. Mother of 2 wonderful girls and wife to a very understanding Husband.
www.hiddenriverranch.weebly.com
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2 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Wed Mar 16, 2011 7:40 pm

maddyfofatty

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I was wondering about vaccination and medicated feed and so forth - is it necessary for a small flock? By small I mean a dozen or so. I know you have a whole lot of birds hidden river and I can understand vacc. for a large number of birds! I was hoping for "au naturel" but, I don't want to risk the health of the birds - confusing... confused

3 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Wed Mar 16, 2011 7:43 pm

ChicoryFarm

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My partner never vaccinated when I moved here to be with him and he had been raising chickens off and on for years. He also never had had lice or mites. As a result, I wasn't planning to with my first set of chicks last year but a new friend of mine in the area who had chicks, strongly recommended vaccinating for coccidiosis and Mareks because her chickens have had both and she keeps a clean coop re: coccidiosis and lost an entire young flock to Mareks, so I fed medicated starter and she vaccinated my chicks for Mareks. I couldn't do it myself as the needle seemed so big to the chick as a newbie poultry owner.

This year I plan on using the coccidiosis gel spray and injecting the Mareks with the help of my friend but I am determined to do it with her as well, so next time I can do all by myself.

ILT is alive and well in the Fraser Valley here in BC and even though I am in the Kootenays, I think I will do that as well. I raise my birds on an organic diet and in as much a holistic way as possible but know based on experience with my other animals that it is not enough to avoid diseases and believe that it is just a matter of time for those who don't and sometimes that's what it takes for people who choose not to. Not a judgement AT ALL, just my experience and opinion.

4 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:06 pm

Hidden River

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What got me thinking about and deciding to vaccinate was the intensity of the disease these birds can get. And the fact that birds can be carriers for life once infected and infect your entire flock.
If you ever decide to show your birds it would be strongly reccomended you vaccinate. Also if you ever plan on bringing in adult birds to your already existing flocks.
Marek's disease is such a debilitating disease, birds that you have raise, put all your time, feed and hearts into then die for no reason. So see a bird go down with paralysis and not be able to do anything about it would be so heartbreaking knowing you could have prevented it.
I used to believe "natural selection" that whatever we had here should develop immunity on it's own, and "survival of the fittest" but although that does work and these birds do develop immunity to certain diseases over time I learned that they would always be carriers of these diseases. I feel it is my duty as a poultry person to try and do my part in reducing the spread of diseases, therefore if I want to sell started or adult birds it is the best decision to vaccinate them early to protect them, and then feel comfortable knowing I did everything I could for them when I sell them to some other person.

There is so much to find out about these diseases and hopefully there will be lots of information made available to us as poultry producers.


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Raising Heritage Chickens, Guinea Fowl, Waterfowl, Katahdin Sheep, Angus and Jersey Cattle. Mother of 2 wonderful girls and wife to a very understanding Husband.
www.hiddenriverranch.weebly.com
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5 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:44 pm

maddyfofatty

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I will vaccinate! I don't want to learn the hard way - where does one get these vacc's. and or meds? Is it expensive?

6 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:42 pm

cbotkin

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I vaccinate for Mareks and ILT as well. The entire breeder flock including all the pheasants and quail are getting done this weekend, as well as the 4-week old babies. I am going to do the booster in another 6 weeks. The timing is perfect now as the shows are minimal. I will be using the LT-IVAX, which I would strongly encourage everyone to do. LT-IVAX is a tissue culture vaccine and has a greatly reduced likelihood of shedding and mutating into a pathogenic form.
I do the Mareks as well at one day old, it is not too bad once you get the hang of it. Use 22 guage by half inch needles on a 1 ml syringe and it goes pretty quick. Can anyone get 200 ml bags of diluent? We only have access to 400 ml bags, and it is a real pain to accurately remove 200 ml to get the appropriate dilutions.

Thanks,
Clayton

http://www.cbotkin.ca

7 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:45 pm

mirycreek

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We vaccinate for ILT with the nonshedding vaccine
LT-IVAX. Any chicks we are keeping beyond 4 weeks will have their initial dose and if people are interested we may be able to help them obtain a bottle to do the booster at 10 weeks old on the chicks they get from us.

It is administered via eyedrop method, you mix your vaccine with the dilutant, catch each chick and put 1 drop in their eye and wait for them to swallow.

It is quite simple.

Still on the fence about Marek's vaccine at the moment...

http://www.feathers-farm.webs.com

8 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:55 pm

ChicoryFarm

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Sue/Maddyfo,

You can get the Coccidi spray, Marek's and ILT from here: http://www.canadianpoultry.ca/ . Call me 250-229-4285 if you want to get it shipped with mine and Jen's order. I'm phoning them on Friday of this week for delivery early the following week. It comes by Greyhound in ice packs.

Can someone clarify for me please.....ideally the coccidiosis spray is done the first day and we DO NOT feed medicated starter, Marek's is also done (injected) the first day and then when is ILT via eye drops- first time at how many weeks and then booster 6 weeks later?

And I am getting pullets at 4 weeks old in May who won't be vaccinated with Mareks. Is it too late to vaccinate them then?

Clayton, missed you coming on board - welcome!



9 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Fri Apr 15, 2011 11:38 am

Guest


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We are vaccinating for ILT using LT-IVAX from scherring plough/intervet for chicks at 2-4 weeks old, and again at 2-3 months old.

Since we only use a small portion of the 1000 doses of the vial, we are coordinating with other farms in the area so that we help eachother out and get as many birds vaccinated as we can within the 2 hour window that the reconstituted vaccine is viable.

10 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Fri Apr 15, 2011 11:42 am

Hidden River

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Chickenlee are you saying that a 2 week old chick can mount enough of a response at that young of an age we can start them that young?
I have been doing 4 week olds and 8-10 week old boosters. It makes it somewhat more difficult when I have 2 age groups in one brooder, usually 3-4 week olds, so I have been tending to wait and do them at 4-5 weeks old...


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Raising Heritage Chickens, Guinea Fowl, Waterfowl, Katahdin Sheep, Angus and Jersey Cattle. Mother of 2 wonderful girls and wife to a very understanding Husband.
www.hiddenriverranch.weebly.com
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11 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Fri Apr 15, 2011 11:44 am

BriarwoodPoultry

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I would LOVE to vaccinate for mareks, if only I could get vaccine. Still waiting for vaccine to be shipped to me from
canada poultry.. Sad

http://briarwoodpoultry.weebly.com

12 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Fri Jan 27, 2012 6:26 am

Rasilon

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cbotkin wrote:I vaccinate for Mareks and ILT as well. The entire breeder flock including all the pheasants and quail are getting done this weekend, as well as the 4-week old babies. I am going to do the booster in another 6 weeks.


Question please... Do you have to vaccinate your flocks every year or is one shot plus booster shot a few weeks later good for the life of the bird? I went to the Canada poultry site and there is no mention that I could see about buying vaccine. I would like to vaccinate my birds. Thanks Geri

13 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Fri Jan 27, 2012 6:31 am

Hidden River

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Rasilon you will need to call them directly. Tell them what you plan to do and then they get it worked out with you.
With Mareks disease you do them just once as day old chicks.
The ILT is an innitial, 4-6 week booster, and then yearly to keep their protection up.


_________________
Raising Heritage Chickens, Guinea Fowl, Waterfowl, Katahdin Sheep, Angus and Jersey Cattle. Mother of 2 wonderful girls and wife to a very understanding Husband.
www.hiddenriverranch.weebly.com
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14 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Fri Jan 27, 2012 12:00 pm

toybarons

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I vaccinate. We feed medicated feed to our chicks and when we order chicks from any hatchery we have them vaccinated for Merecks. We vaccinate also for ILT using LT-IVAX.

ILT was the hardest to decide on. We sat on the fence whether or not to vaccinate as the advice we got always seemed to raise more questions than they answered. Even after speaking to our provincial vet, we were still hung up on to do or not to do.

What really changed our minds was when we started doing shows. There was talk about a sale that had happened years ago, whose birds had possibly passed ILT to a buyers flock. We then asked ourselves how we would feel if one of our birds had ILT and we unknowingly passed it on at a show?
That was our deciding factor to vaccinate.

15 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Fri Jan 27, 2012 12:06 pm

Schipperkesue

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ILT- non shdding for me. Thought about Mereks, but I would rather lose a few and have others that have built up their natural immunity. We shall see if I am singing the same tune after my birds with their natural immunity hatch chicks of their own this year. I also use medicated feed and Eprinex regularly for parasites. I will use an oral anti-parasite med a couple times a year as well.

Sue

16 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Fri Jan 27, 2012 2:34 pm

Sebas49

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I don’t vaccinate and probably would. I did vaccinate for ILT may years ago but have not done so in a long long time. Once you start to vaccinate you will need to vaccinate every year because the birds will not build up a natural resistant to fight off any disease. Mareks is the worst. If you stop vaccinating for Mareks after you did it for a very years, you will probably lose 80% or more of your birds. If ILT is around and starts to become a problem in the area and your birds might be exposed to it, I would say best to vaccinate, but once you start you will need to carry on. ILT will discolor the eye, so a bird with the wrong colored eye will not do well in stiff competition.

My partner Casey raises Sebrights. He always vaccinated for Mareks very year. Last year he raised close 100 Sebrights and didn’t vaccinate. We felt if a few lived then they would be resistant to Mareks and we would be on our way. Well they all died of Mareks. Sebright breeders have always vaccinated show stock Sebrights for Mareks. They have no resistance to it now so you have no choice but to vaccinate if you want some birds to live.

It’s your decision. My opinion is don’t vaccinate, let the birds built up their natural immunity

http://www.c-rducks.com

17 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Fri Jan 27, 2012 3:11 pm

Schipperkesue

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Thanks Rico,

You give me hope with that Mereks issue.

Sue

18 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Fri Jan 27, 2012 3:30 pm

CynthiaM

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I don't and won't vaccinate. I want birds with natural immunities. Just a personal choice. Could be right, could be wrong. I had two birds afflicted with what I believe to be mareks. They died. They had been vaccinated by the breeder. Long story, been there before, and choose not to relay the story again. It may help, but as indicated, once you begin to vaccinate, you pretty much must continue onwards. I don't know. Kind of into building up natural immunity for things with my birds. Again, personal choice. Only the strong survive. Right, wrong attitude, I don't know, but it works for me. Have a wonderful day, CynthiaM.

19 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Fri Jan 27, 2012 6:36 pm

Piet

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I haven't vaccinated yet and would certainly not just start it as a precaution, even if the juice is given to me for free. I know my same closed flocks for years and they are vital and strong, have been around at other places and have moved to other places and kept in good health. Having heard the same story that Rico told before from several other good and experienced breeders, I hope to learn from their shared knowledge. Listen listen listen and study

Piet

http://pvgflemishgiants.tripod.com/

20 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Fri Jan 27, 2012 7:09 pm

Hidden River

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Piet wrote:I haven't vaccinated yet and would certainly not just start it as a precaution, even if the juice is given to me for free. I know my same closed flocks for years and they are vital and strong, have been around at other places and have moved to other places and kept in good health. Having heard the same story that Rico told before from several other good and experienced breeders, I hope to learn from their shared knowledge. Listen listen listen and study

Piet
I agree if you have a closed flock but anyone that goes to shows, sells and buys birds, etc. I think is a good idea to vaccinate, at least for ILT.
I think building up immunty to Mareks would work over time with somewhat resistant birds,but as Rico said the Show Seebrights are very non resistant and therefore it would be a good idea to protect them. As for ILT you cannot build natural immunity, yes if you never sell your birds you can, but if you have let your birds get ILT, get over it, and do ok that is fine for you to keep them, but to introduce new birds they would all have to go through it again, the ones that built up resistance would probably still do fine, but the risk would be to the new birds or any existing birds that are run down. The KICKER is if you ever sell these birds they will pass this disease on to their new flock mates. AND if you SHOW these birds you are putting the ENTIRE show at risk!


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Raising Heritage Chickens, Guinea Fowl, Waterfowl, Katahdin Sheep, Angus and Jersey Cattle. Mother of 2 wonderful girls and wife to a very understanding Husband.
www.hiddenriverranch.weebly.com
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21 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:13 pm

Piet

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quote="Hidden River"][/quote]
As for ILT you cannot build natural immunity, yes if you never sell your birds you can, but if you have let your birds get ILT, get over it, and do ok that is fine for you to keep them, but to introduce new birds they would all have to go through it again, the ones that built up resistance would probably still do fine, but the risk would be to the new birds or any existing birds that are run down. The KICKER is if you ever sell these birds they will pass this disease on to their new flock mates. AND if you SHOW these birds you are putting the ENTIRE show at risk![/quote]

Vaccines are available, but are not recommended. Vaccination is not practiced in commercial flocks in Alberta. It is important to realize that vaccination only reduces the risk of disease in exposed birds. It does not prevent infection of vaccinated birds, so they can still be a source of ILTV to susceptible birds for a long period of time. As well, some vaccine strains may be shed from vaccinated birds and cause disease in susceptible unvaccinated contact birds.


MY ANIMALS DO NOT CARRY ILT, WHEREAS YOUR VACCINATED STOCK MIGHT. MY CHICKENS DO NOT PUT ANY OTHERS AT RISK, AT LEAST NOT THAT I KNOW OF FOR THE LAST 8 YEARS. WHEN I DO INTRODUCE NEW BLOOD, I DO IT CAREFULLY! MY COOPS, I KEEP THEM CLEAN AND ARE NOT OVERCROWDED.

http://pvgflemishgiants.tripod.com/

22 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:42 pm

Blue Hill Farm

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I do not vaccinate, preferring to go the route of natural selection and breeding for disease resistance. Once I’ve built my foundation stock up enough, I plan to only breed from mature birds in their second season to increase disease resistance, as well hardiness and longevity in general. Thus only the strongest will survive to carry on the future generations.

Hidden, from my understanding one way to build a natural resistance/immunity for ILT would be to only keep and breed from birds that showed zero symptoms to the disease. Any birds that became sick (even if they recovered) wouldn’t work because they’ve already shown a natural lack of resistance and would be carriers for life. In time the future generations would be immune, having inherited their parent’s/grandparent's immunities, at least to that strain of the disease.

Anyway, I don’t think there’s a right or wrong answer here. Just different strokes.

23 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:53 pm

coopslave

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I don't vaccinate and I don't plan on starting. I don't show either, at this stage.
Some breeds are more susceptible to Mareks than others. My first passion for pure birds started with Barnevelders in Australia. They were notorious for dieing from Mareks. I lost 50% the first year. I never keep a bird that showed signs, only ones that were never effected. I developed resistance in my flock and at the end of 4 years had no losses to Mareks.

The only time it would show up again is if I introduced a pullet from another line that had been vaccinated. Her offspring, in the first year would always have some loses. After that, none. She had not developed the resistance, but her offspring that survived and then bred with my roosters would have the resistance I had bred for.

I hope that was at least a little understandable! Rolling Eyes

That is what I did for 10 years and it worked well. I plan to do the same thing here. I have not had trouble yet, but I may have. I plan to breed through it if I do run into trouble if I can.

It is a personal decision and you have decide what works best for you and your flock.

24 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Fri Jan 27, 2012 9:12 pm

Rasilon

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It’s your decision. My opinion is don’t vaccinate, let the birds built up their natural immunity
[/quote]

Is this true of ILT as well?
Geri

25 Re: Who Vaccinate's their flocks? on Fri Jan 27, 2012 9:37 pm

Rasilon

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What really changed our minds was when we started doing shows. There was talk about a sale that had happened years ago, whose birds had possibly passed ILT to a buyers flock. We then asked ourselves how we would feel if one of our birds had ILT and we unknowingly passed it on at a show?
That was our deciding factor to vaccinate.[/quote]


Well this reply could also go under the topic "what did you bring home that you didn't intend to". Freinds traveled to the red deer show in Dec. They took birds to show and purchased 2 trios. They brought home a black rose comb hen for me that I have never seen yet as they also brought home ILT. They lost all but 2 of the hirds they purchased and most of what they took. They have a closed coop now and I can't get my bird, will probably never see her. They are hoping to get eggs off of her so I can use hens out of her with my lone blue rosecomb rooster. My question is since the birds that had ILT were at the show does that mean all the birds there were exposed and if they are vaccinated after that fact will they never get it? Will they be carries and give it to to other birds? Do you have to vaccinate older birds as well as chicks if you vaccinate? My friends are very responsible and they are going to dispose of their flock and start over with new chicks but it seems like such a waste to have to start over. If they never went to the show they wouldn't have to do this. Is culling everything the only thing that can be done with ILT?
Geri

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